Christianity understands man to be fallen man, and to inherit the sin of Adam and Eve. Islam, on the other hand, says God forgave Adam and Eve their sin.

So Christianity understands that man is born in a state of sin. What will save man from this sin? Jesus, according to the faith and teaching of the Christian Church.

Christianity teaches that Jesus died on the cross and understands this death as salvific, it merits the grace of God's forgiveness to all who call on the name of Jesus, believe in him, and transform their lives.

Jesus's death, according to Christianity, is redemptive for all humanity.

According to Islam, Jesus did not die on the cross, but was received into Heaven and will return again.

So on two counts, Islam does NOT have a teaching

- of all persons being inherently sinful,

- and in need of the grace given by God in the life and death of Jesus, grace which is transmitted into the life of the Christian via ritual and sacrament and participation in the liturgies of the Church.



Somewhat akin to Islam, Christianity teaches that man has the gift of responsibility for his life, his actions, his intentions and the outcome of his or her actions. People are free to choose what they will do, and merit the consequences of their choices.

Where their choices commit harm to themselves, to others or to their relationship with God in any or all of these actions, then it is said in common among the religions that man has sinned and fallen short of reflecting and furthering the Glory of God.

Gloria Dei vivens homo, the Glory of God is man fully alive. (Iraneaus). Iranaeus also put a rider or a condition on this:

In order to be fully alive, man must see God.

Hell, you can define any way you like. Hell is commonly thought of as the afterlife in a state of separation from the vision of God, the glory of God and the grandeur of Paradise.

I think man sends himself to hell, not the faith of any other person nor the teaching of any other religion. When to comes to the crunch, all religions are the same; did you love God, did you love your fellow man, did you serve your fellow man with love and selflessness? These are simply questions about true humnanesss, these actions with elicit the inherent goodness within. That inherent goodness within is motivated by the soul and the love of God.




Some Christians can say whatever they like. It is not binding that all persons have to accept Jesus as the son of God, and has not been binding since 1965 when the Roman Catholic Church taught that good persons can merit heaven by their own love of God and following truth and right conduct in their lives.

What someone who claims to be or describes themselves as Christian says to you in the street is their belief. It is right for them, and NO ON ELSE. So don't take these fanciful thoughts as gospel. They are not.





I think this is a rhetorical question. Jesus taught love of God and love of neighbour, and taught what the blessed life was in the Beatitudes, given in the sermon on the mount. Jesus taught something really, really powerful. Good and Evil exist in the heart of man, and it is what comes out of man in his thoughts, words and deeds that marked him good or evil.

Man is free to choose to love God or not love God. Questions about the "point of rules" are really off the mark. All religion is about Love.

Edited by whiteguru - 04 December 2008 at 3:46am

As to the inherent sinfulness of humanity, we believe this based on the evidence. You have to teach a child how NOT to lie, be covetous, be disrespectful to his parents. Sin comes very naturally to people, almost as though it's built-in. Technically it is not the sin of Adam but that tendency toward rebellion against God. In much the same way that a particular genetic flaw inherited from both parents will result in cystic fibrosis, a flaw in our spiritual genetics, inherited from our first parents, results in sin.

Jesus' death on the cross made salvation available to everyone, did not confer salvation upon everyone. It's still up to us. God is not going to drag anyone kicking and screaming into heaven. It's entirely up to us. If we want the salvation Jesus offers, it's ours, at which point God begins his work on us that will be ongoing until we get to eternity.

Are you suggesting that sin is of no consequence? That reflects an immature understanding of God's feelings about sin. If Jesus' blood in effect bought us back, what business do we have hanging out with sin? Is there no gratitude in our hearts?

I agree with Squeegie here. From personal experience of watching children grow, I have noticed that they are born knowing only their own needs. They are born selfish and as Squeegie said, this has to be taught out of them. If they want something that someone else has, they will naturally try to take by force it if they can because they do not understand the needs of anyone other than themselves. Good parents will teach their child that others have feelings too but this is not a default thought in a child’s brain.

All crime and sin in this world can be grouped under ‘selfishness’. Doing what you want at the expense of others. So sin is carrying on what you were born like. If it was not this way we wouldn’t need guidance from God.

 

I heard Christian heaven and hell described this way once:

Heaven is when someone says to God ‘ok, Your will be done.’

Hell is when God says to someone ‘ok your will be done.’

I hope that makes sense.

To add on to what Mad Cat said, Jesus spoke the very first line of Psalm 22 which would bring the Psalm to the minds of the people witnessing his crucifixion and many would remember the whole Psalm. At the end of the Psalm the writer realizes that God did not really forsake him, but that it only appeared as if God forsook him. One of the main points of the Psalm is that even though God may appear distant, he is close to his people and will never forsake his people. Jesus knew exactly what was going on. Jesus was still teaching on the cross.



I don't know if "inherited the sin of Adam" is the best way of describing it, for that can be misleading and confusing. God created Adam as flesh and spirit. The Holy Spirit is a river of living water which brings life to the spirit of man. Adam had unbroken fellowship with God.

After Adam sinned, that fellowship was broken. The Holy Spirit withdrew this life from Adam's spirit. This is what we describe as spiritual death. Now all humans are born into this death, seperated from the life-giving power of the Holy Spirit. Because of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, and because of spiritual seperation of man's spirit and God's Spirit, all humans love to sin.

Romans 8:6 says, "For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace." How can humans set our minds on the Spirit when our spirit is disconnected from the Spirit which brings life and peace? This leaves us with the ability to set our minds on the flesh alone. Jesus said to Peter in Mark 8:38, "Get behind me, Satan! For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man.” We can't set our minds on the things of God if we have broken fellowship with him.

This is why we need to be born-again (regenerated) by the Holy Spirit and have the Holy Spirit dwell with our spirit and teach us the mind of God. Even so, we are still in our bodies of flesh, so we have a choice as Christians to walk by the spirit (according to the mind of God) or walk by the flesh (according to the mind of man). As unbelievers (non-Christians), we only have the option of walking by the flesh (according to the mind of man).

To simplify the matter in conclusion, God made a covenant with Adam and his descendents and the only restriction was not to eat from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. Adam sinned and his spirit broke fellowship with God's spirit and so God made a new covenant with Adam and his descendents. Since we are all descendents, we are a part of this covenant. Adam needed to be regenerated (born-again) by the Spirit of God, and so do all of his decendents. Children are thus born with the mind of man and not the mind of God. Children need to be born-again (regenerated) by the Holy Spirit. Believers look forward to the resurrection when we are given glorified bodies which will enable us to have the mind of God only.



Jesus Christ didn't die on the cross for all people, but only whosoever will believe. Nowhere does the Bible say that Jesus died for all people, but only that Jesus died for those who will believe. The Bible does say that Jesus' death is to be preached and offered to all. Jesus said in Matthew 12:14, "For many are called, but few are chosen.” Jesus died for those who will believe. He did not die for those who will not believe.

John 3:16 teaches that the purpose of Jesus first coming is to redeem those who will believe. "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only son, that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." God loved the world that Jesus came for whosoever will believe.



If you love your parents, how can you spend your whole life rebelling against them? If you love God, how can you spend your whole life breaking his laws and living for yourself? Our purpose for living is not to go to heaven. Our purpose for living is to glorify God. The only reason we go to heaven is so we can glorify God forever.

I hope these answers will help you to understand the Gospel of Christ better.

Edited by yeshua_seven - 04 December 2008 at 1:40pm

Isham, live a sinless life, subject yourself to rejection by the people you came to save and endure the punishment of every sin ever committed, past present and future. Then you will be qualified to call Jesus' reaction to the torture of the cross into question. You seem to forget that while we believe Jesus to be God, we also view him as fully human as well. This past summer I taught a sunday school class that examined this very aspect of Jesus' life on earth. What follows is one of the lessons- 

AS HUMAN AS IT GETS:

HOW JESUS DEALT WITH DOUBT AND FEAR

 

We generally don’t associate these feelings with Jesus. He tends to be our model of confidence and trust. But He did experience these thoughts with greater intensity than any of us may ever have to.

Fear and doubt tend to be companion feelings. Fear shakes up our understanding of the world as we expect it to be and doubt follows because our preconceptions aren’t as trustworthy as we had thought they were.

 

READ-            Matt. 4:3-11; Mark 4:35-40; John 18: 20-23

 

1.      In these passages we find Jesus in difficult circumstances, yet He doesn’t seem troubled by them. Why do you think He could face Satan, a storm on the Galilee, and the Jewish authorities without fear?

 

 

 

READ-            John 14:6

 

Jesus makes some very pointed claims about Himself in this verse. Consider for a moment what these claims imply. As the way to God, the embodiment of truth, and having existed from eternity as the source of all life, death was a foreign concept to Him. You and I know in varying degrees and in increasing quantity as life goes on that we are dying. Illnesses that were shaken off in twenty-four hours as a child may now lay us out for days. Sprains that disappeared quickly continue to trouble us for weeks. I find that I know more and more folks in the cemetery. Our life is a long series of reminders that we are destined to die. Jesus never suffered these “little deaths”, these reminders of mortality. He lived a life in which He knew that His Father was with Him at all times. When He saw in the scriptures that He was to die, He knew it was not because of anything that He did. And maybe because He was dying for everything that we did, the prospect was even more frightening.

 

READ-            1 John 4:18; Luke 22:39-46

      2.      Where did Jesus’ fears force Him to go?  Would you consider this a healthy response?

                  3.      Do you ever think of fear as an unhealthy response
                  for a Christian? Why or why not?

 

READ-            Matt. 3:17; Matt. 17:5; Matt.27: 46                       

 

4.      Do you view Jesus’ cry from the cross as an expression of doubt?
5.      How might God’s affirming statements from earlier in Matthew’s gospel add to the uncertainty Jesus was feeling?
6.      What does it say about God that Jesus felt He could express Himself like this to His father? 

 

The function of a smoke detector is to let us know we need to be somewhere else. The annoying sound is telling us that it isn’t safe where we are and we need to remove ourselves to somewhere that is safe.
 

            7.  If we think of fear and doubt as a spiritual smoke detector, what message do you think they might be sending?

Hi,

Oh,  I just really want his response as he is very curious and objective.